Does All Solid Wood Matter? | Martin 000-12e vs. 000-13e
We talk a lot about the importance of (at the very least) a solid wood top on an acoustic guitar, but once the top is solid, how important is the rest of the body? Today we’re taking a look at two very similar Martin guitars to put this to the test, the 000-12e and the 000-13e; one of which has a laminate back/sides of Layered Koa, the other having solid Siris back/sides. Can you hear the difference? What tonal nuances can you hear between the layered and solid constructions? Let us know in the comments!
Comparison starts at 9:55
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Originally posted by UCIB3DqQuXKmM7DzEMppafDA at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWTHfIbZgAQ
Best guitar is what…you love to play it always
unless its your first guitar, YES.
Martin HPL ????
Sawdust, woodchippings, resin, cigarette stumps, cornflake boxes, paper mashe fretboards, the lot ????
Thank u for the comparison. I am actually interested in a new guitar and thinking of a 000 series because of the smaller scale. Me personally did hear a difference and thought the all wood PICKING sounded richer than the koa but I love the strumming sound of the koa verses the all wood. Thank u I think I may take a ride to GC tomorrow because they have a 000-12e Koa there and I want to play it before making a decision. Thanks very much
I think Martin should call it what it is, a plastic guitar, with the most fake-looking wood grain I've ever seen, other than the fake granite formica countertop at my mother-in-law's house. But very similar and the looks of both. Given the choice of their high pressure laminate, that Martin calls it, versus, laminated wood on the back and sides, I'd rather have the laminated wood on the back and sides, with real wood grain, in real wood, instead of Martin's high pressure laminate, which is basically plastic resin…. Go to any guitar shop they carry sees Martin high pressure laminate guitars, and see for yourself how bogus they look. Can you tell me that you would give 5 or 600.00 for a plastic guitar, when you can give $50 for a quality well-built Yamaha guitar with a solid spruce top, and either laminated mahogany or laminated rosewood back and sides. I own a 60s model d18 Martin, a 1949 j50 Gibson, but I also own a Yamaha FG 830, and the fg830 Yamaha, is without a doubt, one of the most well-built, most beautiful guitars, what's a solid spruce top and laminated rosewood back and sides, that you can pick up new for $350 or less, that is a much better guitar, in all aspects, than the Martin hpl, or high pressure laminate, or plastic guitar with fake wood grain embedded in the plastic, all day long for almost half the price. If you're going to buy a guitar, at least buy a real wood guitar, I'm not a plastic, high pressure laminate guitar, has Martin called it. Because there's not anything different than that and the formica on your kitchen counter… There's no way in hell I would give you $500 for a plastic guitar, with the Martin logo on it. Unless you just want to pay $500 so that it says Martin on the headstock…. But don't just take my word for it, go to your nearest guitar shop and try out the new Martin plastic guitars, then try out, a Yamaha guitar that's made from wood. I promise you you will hear the difference, and see the difference in your wallet. ????
The layered one has too much compression, not enough headroom. Certain notes and chords sound amazing, it just sounds slightly choked. Could be just right for someone.
I definitely prefer the solid wood one. Just hearing of siris wood… thanks for sharing
The differences will show up as they age, with playing.
Inspiraton has much value
It's yet another case of they're plainly different, but one is not necessarily superior to the other. Laminates are fine by me.
I like Cooper's question at 16 minutes. Solids seem to me to feel more alive against your body, but I have never made a fair comparison.
Interesting stuff, chaps!
To be less expensive the plywood has to be made of far less value woods, basically scrap.
Neither guitar sounds great here
A major factor that is usually overlooked is repairs. Repair of a laminated guitar would probably require replacing the back and sides. This would not be worth the cost in most cases.
Laminate or solid?
When you play an acoustic, the back and sides are muted by your body. The back is pressed against your body and clothes and similar with the sides. It really is only the top which is I mostly unhindered.
Both sounded great, however if taken care well would the solid wood slowly get better tone with time.?
I like the D18 sound. In my opinion the D10E is the best guitar in the Martin lineup with the added bonus of having a pickup for a bargain price. It’s a must have for me.
You can tell the difference, as you’d expect. The solid tone wood much richer, fuller and bell-like sound with greater sustain. Amazing!
The 000-15SM is a 12 fret parlor guitar in full mahogany, with a 25.4" scale length and a slotted headstock. Hands down the best acoustic I've ever owned
I think the solid body sounded better when strummed, the laminate sounded better with the finger style playing.
There is no difference. Anyone who says there is a difference is a liar
according to this video, i actually prefer the sound of the koa lamimate. it rang clear like a piano
I want to buy the 000-13e but i cant even find one on Martins website. Does anyone know why? Is there different nomenclature to look it up under?
All in all, nobody but the player will notice
Over time, yes it's very important for sound and longevity. Laminate and artificial back and sides don't expand and contract alongside the solid top. You'll end up with cracks as it gets older that a full solid wood guitar would not have.
Does it matter ?…you ask. Well, i live in the tropics. I decided to do an inspection of my ES137. After lifting the neck pickup off the body , i noticed that the pickup routing had begun to delaminate. I wasn't pleased. That was my last laminate guitar. Never again , will i buy a laminate. So, to answer your question, " Does it matter ? "……….Yes, it sure does. Obviously the geographical element comes into play , as well as the type of glues used. One day, when high quality carbon fibre becomes the norm , i'll jump ship.
Reviewing this again I thought I would update my comment. I purchased the 000-12e because at the time Sweetwater and others didn't have the13e in stock and I didn't want to wait. It was a surprise to me when I found out that Martin had discontinued the 000-13e. Why? No idea. I found a supposedly mint D13e for sale on Facebook locally for $700. I have been chatting with the seller and asked why so low price and his answer was he started out higher and got no responses….strange… I don't need another 000 Martin as I have 2 of them and have been looking at the D13e and am wondering why it had Ziricote back and sides instead of Siris, and wondering if that is part of the reason Martin discontinued the 000…. guess I'll never know…
I had the 000-13e .. it was a mediocre sounding and playing guitar for a Martin,
I would have liked a comparison with the all solid 000-Junior! ????
Solid wood sounds more softer and earthyer.
It's not about how it sounds now but what it will sound like after 10 years of playing. Solid wood changes whereas laminate never changes
The all solid wood sounds more balanced and the layered Koa sounds bright and tinny
Just tried a 00013e and was very pleasantly surprised. All solid woods ( siris ?) Sounds like mahogany at half the price. I was looking at a Taylor grand Pacific but ……..
If laminated back and sides sounded as good or better than solid, Martin would have laminated models in their standard series.
Played laminates for decades, until I finally decided to get me „professional“ guitars, even though I only play for hobby. My favorites are the HD-28 and the Dove (very different guitars). Regarding sound, I still own cheapish laminates that are better suited and thus better sounding for specific songs imo, so I think sound is not (!) the factor by that you should decide whether you‘d like to play a laminate or solid guitar. It’s all in the feeling. Solids feel so much better that I like to play them much more, and thus a lot more often. So in my feeling, my music is superior when I play one of my solids. I kept only those laminates that sound in a way that none of my solids do, and am constantly trying to find solids that sound similar just because I want to replace them by guitars that feel better to me. I don’t think it’s scientific at all, just feeling/psychology.
I really couldn’t hear a difference.
As a player I can tell the difference between, solid rosewood, mahogany, walnut and maple backs and definitely laminate backs. I agree it's the top that gives you most of the tone. I've played cedar, spruce (different varieties) and mahogany tops. They are all different. Laminate backs are very noticeably different in tone.
They both sound good. Hard to tell a negligible difference. Sounds like 2 acoustic guitars
The layered Koa sound beautiful ❤
They are still two different types of woods though I would love to see a layered mahogany vs. Solid mahogany comparison. In this video the solid wood wins hands down more bass Fuller and wider sound.
All wood sounds muffled
I bought a laminate Martin when i was young and its dissapointing. It just doesnt have that "Martin" sound. No where close. Its flat and dull. My $100 Recording King solid top sounds way better.
the sound of the wood matters only when the guitar is played before a mic .. once, plugged in, the sound of the wood won't matter anymore ????
Both sound great. I lean toward the all solid back and sides. It has a warmer sound but the Koa is bright. Hey, they are both Martin. Everyone should own a solid top Martin.
Not necesseraly it doesnt have to be constant solid unless someone does a video…
Scale lengths:
000 = 24.9"
OM = 25.4"