Which Mic Should I Buy for Classical Guitar? Aston Starlight vs Audio Technica 4041 vs Neumann KM184
Alex and Nathan team up to answer the classic question: which mic should I buy for classical guitar? We will take you through a few excerpts on each mic to help you decide which small diaphragm condenser microphone is right for your needs.
Timestamps:
Intro: 00:00
Context: 0:46
Mics used: 1:19
Technical details: 2:04
Disclaimer: 3:04
Guitars used: 3:29
Bach Aston Starlight Vintage: 4:07
Bach Aston Starlight Hybrid: 4:35
Bach Aston Starlight Modern: 5:01
Bach AT 4041: 5:28
Bach KM 184: 5:56
Etude Aston Starlight Vintage: 6:30
Etude Aston Starlight Hybrid: 7:03
Etude Aston Starlight Modern: 7:36
Etude AT 4041: 8:08
Etude KM 184: 8:40
Guernica Aston Starlight Vintage: 9:43
Guernica Aston Starlight Hybrid: 10:06
Guernica Aston Starlight Modern: 10:29
Guernica AT 4041: 10:53
Guernica KM 184: 11:18
Nascence Aston Starlight Vintage: 11:59
Nascence Aston Starlight Hybrid: 12:41
Nascence Aston Starlight Modern: 13:24
Nascence AT 4041: 14:08
Nascence KM 184: 14:53
Ending: 15:39
Nascence (from Journey): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWIHtqv_Eks
Nathan’s Etude in E Minor: https://nathanbredeson.ca/product/etude-in-e-minor/
Mics tested:
Aston Starlight: https://www.astonmics.com/EN/product/mics/starlight
Audio Technica AT 4041: https://www.audio-technica.com/en-ca/at4041
Neumann KM 184: https://en-de.neumann.com/km-184
Video editing by Nathan Bredeson
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#Mic #Buy #Classical #Guitar #Aston #Starlight #Audio #Technica #Neumann #KM184
Originally posted by UCRQxlyZ5ANUtU7VWvuiLD0g at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgbVYMw7skA
Interesting. Seems like the A-S on Vintage did the lows better but the Neuman seemed cleaner all around (though all ex) and the A-T had the consistent tonal range w/o the price. For the amateur, imo, a toss-up, a preference whose differences can dealt with in production.
Call me crazy but I really liked the vintage voicing on the starlight. It does sound a lot like tape the way it is voiced!
Audio technica! I would love to hear this through massive reverb like a strymon Big sky or something That's what I'm planning on doing… You guys would do it much better than I would!
Congratulations, I did a shootout with steelstring guitar. It was at4041 vs. Atm450 both Audio Technica. It was clearly won by the atm450. So if someone is looking for a great budget mic it might be a good idea to give it a try.
Thanks for the comparison and great playing. To my ears the Starlight sounds muddy none of the three settings was convincing. The AT sounds very clear, much better. The Neumann has also the clarity but adds some more body to the sound. But everybody’s ears and taste are different. On budget it would be the ATs otherwise the Neumann.
great video. I use the AT 4042 with great success (maybe a bit more neutral), also using a pair of schoeps would sure be superior. I have a question concerning the sock like arm hose and the piece of wood on the guitar: are these tools to avoid unwanted noise i.e. sweaty skin sticking to wood during the recording process? and if so: where is this available? ????
Awesome video! Let’s try the Austrian Audio CC8 stereo set next, shall we?
This definitely helped clarify to me that the Aston Spirit sounds comparatively muffled and muddy, which I was wondering if the sintered cap would do ????
Hi! Nice test! I was surprised, but in test no. 1 I prefer AT 4041 and in the last 3 tests Neumanns. But, for the half price, the AT 4041 are perfect and nobody can hear the difference on the recording made with 4041s, if he has no comparsion to Neumanns! ????
Do you know brand new mics from Rode – TF-5? They are now sold only as a matched pair amd should be the most premium mics of the "new generation" designed with famous classical music producer Tony Faulkner ( = TF). They should be in the top range of all SDC mics and some people compare them to DPA 4011. I own a pair of DPA 4011 and they are FANTASTIC! If Rode made mics pair of similar sound quality, at the 1/3 of the price of DPAs, then hallelujah! ????
Please, test them and compare them to KM 184 and DPA 4011 ????
THANKS!
Thanks for putting this video together, I’m always interested in hearing gear comparisons for classical guitar!
The thing I’m very sensitive to is self noise with microphones, the minute you apply some processing to the audio (any light compression and limiting for a modern, clear recording), the self noise becomes a critical factor, because to me even a great sounding mic can be ruined by noise if it’s too high.
The KM184s sound noticeably quieter than the others here (even more than the 2dB of difference on paper), which I predict would be even more exaggerated with processing. To me that’s worth it, and the microphone (typically being a bigger source of noise than the preamp) should be the first thing you upgrade in your signal chain.
My only slight complaint of the 184s is the high frequency boost falls right in the region of sound where the nail scratches the string, and that’s something I’m looking to avoid by filing my nails.
Even better I’ve found is the Neumann TLM193 which has a medium sized capsule, fast transients but with even lower noise (10dBA vs 13dBA for the 184s) that has a lovely flat sound right up to the highs, very popular with professional classical/orchestral sound engineers for spot mic’ing instruments, you can always add some high eq to your taste afterwards which it takes very well.
And if you have a great room (and a huge budget!), the Schoeps MK2 capsules sound wonderful, are also very quiet (10dBA) but are omnidirectional, which has pros and cons, pro that they don’t exhibit boomy proximity effect up close, but they hear all the room’s imperfections more.
Thanks again!
Great video! I have an AT4041 and was just using it for recording my steel string guitar. The result was quite bright and kinda harsh – I thought I was mic’ing it incorrectly. Then I borrowed a friend’s mic that is a KM84 (not 184) clone. Holy cow, the 4041 mic is VERY bright in comparison – similar to your video. Actually though, the 4041 mixed with the KM84 clone sounded better than either mic alone, even after applying some EQ to both. I had them right next to one another and phase-aligned, so mixing them was straightforward.
HUH. To my ears, the Neumanns have an beautiful amount of detail but it's sometimes almost too much. I consistently prefer how the Starlights seem to smooth the sound over, especially on the Hybrid setting, which is pleasantly balanced and clear. It's almost like the Starlights are applying a slight EQ curve and discarding some extra audio info in a way I like, even if the Neumanns are more accurate. Meanwhile, the Audio-Technica strike me as pretty good but a little sterile or brittle sounding.
Anyways, for half the price and the extra features the Starlights sure look good to me. (The laser actually seems like it could be pretty useful, even if it initially sounds kinda gimmicky! And I could imagine the different voicings being useful for different sources )
What did you end up going for? As I'm about to hit buy on this "demo" pair on the Ottawa L&Q, I'm wondering if I just might be getting the same pair you rented!
(Lovely playing and sound overall too, the way those harmonics never seem to stop and condense into a ringing cloud kinda blew me away)
I loved the Aston Starlight
I loved the Aston Starlight, the audio tech was too bright for my taste and the Neumann just didnt do anything for me. Question when we are listing to these mics are we hearing them panned L n R or are they both Centered? Thanks
The AT4041s are very unforgiving on CG and quite harsh.
neuman
Would the AT4041 be good for dialogue as well?
Wow – next to his super successful foto and film channel Peter Mc Kinnon has a Guitar channel 😉 just discovered you today – cool channel
These are all okay… honestly, the room counts for more than people think. If you had a budget of $1k, IMO you should spend half on treating your space to absorb reflections, and use the other half for the best single sdc (or set) at the $500 price.
Also, remember that the guitar “reads” as a mono source when in a hall, so after recording and processing, adding a little reverb… your mono mic will be enough.
For on location recording, obviously you want a pair, but a matched pair isn’t always necessary – a mid-side recording can sound great if you have one figure 8 mic.
Either AT or KM seems good. Keep in mind the acoustics, not very good acoustics nor appropriately controlled, a lot of early unpleasant reflections that's not due to the mics. As a mastering engineer listening in a controlled studio, both seems fine, but KM does sound especially good for nylon guitar because it has some bite to it, probably the AT would be better for cymbals etc, because its a little softer or even neutral
The "u" in "Guernica" is pronounced just like the "u" in another Spanish word: "Guitar".
(= not at all – the "u" is only there to indicate a hard "G").
And I've hear Spanish art experts put the emphasis "Guer-NI-ca
I´ve just bought a zoom h1n but I don´t like very much the sound for classical guitar. I am thinking about buying a zoom h5 and some condeser micro, do you think it would be a good idea?
Oh que j'ai aimé ça
????
Starlights are such a good value…. the untrained ear goes for the at4041's because they are brighter. The km 184 and starlights are so close in style and flavor. You should show the starlights with the roll of engaged in the different modes, much more balanced with out the hype. There is a reason why the classical world would choose the km 184 over the at4041 on stringed instruments. In the classical world the mic position for such a mic would be above the performers head pointed down at the instrument. we are talking a good three to four feet from the source and that is where that warm low end comes into play and where the at4041 begins to sound thin and distant. The Starlights can keep up the 184's in this regard and a few other areas as well. They really do hit above their price point. I would like to suggest the Roswell audio line up for review as well as the Austrian Audio offerings. They are making some great microphones too that fair very well against the classics from Sennheiser/Neuman, DP, and the usual classical mic lockers.
Should experiment with small condensers closer to the instrument.
Vraiment cool comme vidéo! Merci les gars! Je dois avouer que tous les extraits sonnent bien… Il y a tellement de facteur a prendre en considération lorsque l'on enregistre la guitare (joueur, guitare, cordes, ongles, pièce ou salle, humidité/aération, preamp, filage, etc..) Dans leur gamme de prix, les Starlight sont très efficaces car ils aident à "tweeker" ces "facteurs" d'un enregistrement à un autre. On peut même sortir quelque chose de raisonnable avec des Behringer C-2! haha.
Merci encore pour les comparaisons dans cette vidéo. C'est super intéressant!
This is so good – I wish I had a more technical video like this when I was first researching! Super informative and loved the audio demos as well! Gonna send this to people whenever they ask me about mics now =)
Great playing! I wasn't blown away by any of the mics. I find Starlights useable but not delicious. The KM's always sound good and precise but somehow tend towards feeling a little bit over bright for my tastes on classical guitar. For me, all AT mics on solo classical guitars tend towards being harsh or they lack detail. I found these ones harsh and maybe better for cutting through a mix than solo. To my ear, the Starlights are a clear choice out of the three if on a tight budget and not owning a lot of different mics. Even though the Neumann's are a little more precise and defined, the law of diminishing returns means it's only a little, and really hard to justify the price difference. I'm still looking for a holy grail combo myself, as it is not in my mic cabinet as we speak. Thanks for the excellent comparison!
Thanks for doing this guys! Really informative and helpful
and thanks for doing this test! It was really fun to listen to and compare.
I am more than happy with my starlights, I use them almost always on Hybrid setting. Personally I think the difference between the starlights on that setting and the Neumanns is negligible or at the very least would come simply down to personal taste as to which you like more for the subtle differences. For me, that doesn't come anywhere near justifying the huge jump in price, and something that might seem inconsequential but is very important for me is the fact that the starlights come with the built-in lasers. It might seem silly but having those lasers to really see where the mic is pointed at your instrument while you are the one setting them up with the guitar in hand can make a big difference in experimenting with placement and finding the sweet spot for you and your guitar!
I love my Starlights
Really liked the Audio-Technica AT4041, thanks a lot for the demo 🙂
Are any of them cross-rated for other instruments? As in a stringed instrument with a longer sound or something like an accordion that can do long continuous overlapping sounds?
Which microphone did you like the most? Any bets on which one Alex ordered in the end?